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05:27 djcoin: Are Unit commonly used in Racket ? It seems a bit tricky to me
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06:05 asvil: hi all.
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06:15 asvil: I want to decompile "jitted" function, but without calling it (because it faults)
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07:57 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/ANpWuA
07:57 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 642ef7f Robby Findler: dont use raco test for encode.rkt (as it expects command-line...
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07:59 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/tRhPsQ
07:59 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 7750cf9 Robby Findler: change raco test's announcements to say "raco test"
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09:30 samth: asvil: unfortunately, it only gets jitted when called
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09:31 samth: djcoin: units aren't used that much
09:31 samth: for an example that's not so complicated, see the contents of `collects/typed-racket/typechecker`
09:31 djcoin: samth: Alright thanks
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11:28 egnarts-ms: i wonder whether there exists such a Lisp dialect that 1) is translated into pure JavaScript and 2) preserves much of 1-to-1 correspondence with JS
11:29 egnarts-ms: maybe something like Parenscript, but Parenscript is not completely what i mean
11:29 egnarts-ms: more like CoffeeScript, probably
11:30 didi: egnarts-ms: I don't know JS, but I guess it's more about someone doing the library work than the characteristics of a Lisp dialect.
11:30 lewis1711: I am not sure how much 1-1 correspondence there is with JS
11:31 egnarts-ms: lewis1711: for example: CL contains `block', `tagbody', `go' special forms; we leave them aside and do not include in a hypothetical language i'm talking about
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11:32 egnarts-ms: instead, we include try/catch
11:32 egnarts-ms: and for/in, which directly correspond to JS statements
11:32 lewis1711: I don't know CL I'm afraid. all other lisps seem icky to me after racket
11:32 egnarts-ms: something like that
11:34 egnarts-ms: lewis1711: that's not important.  I'm asking this because when i write in JS i cannot help thinking about using a Lisp dialect with automatic translation into JS, instead
11:34 egnarts-ms: chances are that someone has already created such a thing
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11:35 asumu: egnarts-ms: what's the point of a Lisp dialect with JS semantics?
11:35 asumu: That's basically just writing JS with parentheses.
11:35 egnarts-ms: asumu: the point is primarily introducing meta-programming and macros in JS
11:35 mithos28: egnarts-ms: http://planet.plt-scheme.org/package-source/dherman/javascript.plt/9/2/planet-docs/javascript/pjs.html
11:35 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/azujpu7
11:35 mithos28: JS with parens
11:35 asumu: egnarts-ms: JS already has macros
11:36 mithos28: asumu: Really?
11:36 asumu: http://sweetjs.org/
11:36 egnarts-ms: asumu: what do you mean ?
11:37 mithos28: asumu: How do I use said macros within eval?
11:37 egnarts-ms: asumu: looks much like i'm looking for. thanks !
11:37 asumu: egnarts-ms: NP
11:37 asumu: mithos28: I don't know.
11:37 didi: rudybot: (main ((argc : int) (argv : (array* char))) (puts "hello, world") (return 0))
11:37 rudybot: didi: cant say i tried, thats where the shortcoming is, is the argc ?
11:38 didi: rudybot: I see I forget the return type. For that, I'm sorry.
11:38 rudybot: didi: oh, by the way, your life insurance fee went up due to your checkup results, so don't forget to pay the extra €500 before you leave
11:38 didi: Forgot, even.
11:40 asumu: Oh, sweet.js even has something similar to syntax-parse now.
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11:44 asumu: didi: 500 euro for forgetting the return type, that's harsh.
11:45 lewis1711: this is the true cost of static typing
11:45 didi is sad :^(
11:46 egnarts-ms: :) by the way, aside from Typed Racket, Racket doesn't have CL-like type declarations, does it ?
11:47 mithos28: signatures in the student languages
11:47 mithos28: Do you want unsound type declarations?
11:48 didi: mithos28: I guess they want declarations for performance purposes.
11:48 egnarts-ms: what does "unsound" mean ?
11:48 mithos28: that they aren't checked
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11:48 egnarts-ms: ah, i did mean performance-oriented declarations
11:49 mithos28: Right, and CLs are unsafe because they aren't checked
11:49 egnarts-ms: checked ones
11:49 mithos28: so use TR
11:49 lewis1711: I sometimes have idle thoughts about whether a lisp where each atom belonged to a type class, would work.
11:51 Nisstyre: lewis1711: what do you mean?
11:52 Nisstyre: I know what type classes are, and I know what atoms are
11:52 Nisstyre: but I don't see why you would have to make each atom an instance of a type class
11:52 lewis1711: another time perhaps, gotta catch a train. laters!
11:52 (part) lewis1711: "Leaving"
11:52 didi: lewis1711: Some implementations do it (e.g. SBCL).
11:53 Nisstyre: didi: what's the advantage of using type classes?
11:53 didi: Nisstyre: I don't know.
11:53 Nisstyre: so you can do crap like (atom? foo) easier?
11:54 didi: Nisstyre: You can use it with CLOSS.
11:54 Nisstyre: my understanding of type classes comes from Hasle;;
11:54 Nisstyre: *Haskell
11:54 didi: Maybe I'm confused by the term "type class".
11:55 Nisstyre: didi: a type class is basically a constraint
11:55 Nisstyre: you implement the type class by writing down the type class "type" with your parameters, e.g. "Foo a"
11:55 Nisstyre: and then you give the types of all of the "methods" that an instance must implement
11:56 Nisstyre: so then you instantiate it, syntactically, by replacing a with a type
11:56 Nisstyre: and then implementing the methods
11:56 Nisstyre: that's the very high level explanation
11:57 Nisstyre: then you can say that a certain type is constrained by that type class, so the type must be an instance of it
11:58 didi: Nisstyre: In CLOS, you implement a generic method and then methods that dispatch with this or that type argument.
11:59 Nisstyre: didi: I think that is how most OOP languages do this sort of polymorphism
11:59 Nisstyre: although "generic" doesn't mean exactly the same thing I think
11:59 didi: Nisstyre: I see.
11:59 Nisstyre: to me a generic function is one where one or more of the type variables are unconstrained
12:00 Nisstyre: so you can do that in pretty much any language
12:01 Nisstyre: e.g. "length" would be a generic function in Scheme
12:01 Nisstyre: because you can pass in a list of any type
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12:04 didi: Nisstyre: I wouldn't say "length" is a generic function as it does not accept vectors, for example.
12:05 Nisstyre: didi: well it's generic in the type of the list
12:05 Nisstyre: (listof a)
12:05 Nisstyre: of course Scheme has heterogeneous lists in general
12:05 didi: Nisstyre: But lists are heterogeneous.
12:05 Nisstyre: so maybe that's a bad example
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12:05 Nisstyre: ninja'd :P
12:05 didi: Hehe.
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12:06 Nisstyre: didi: I just mean if a variable is anywhere in the type
12:06 didi: Nisstyre: Well, I can't add much to this discussion as I know nothing to almost zero about Types and its wonders.
12:06 Nisstyre: and it is unconstrained
12:06 Nisstyre: didi: I recommend looking at Haskell
12:07 didi: Nisstyre: Cool.
12:07 Nisstyre: or maybe Typed Racket
12:07 Nisstyre: I haven't used Typed Racket though
12:07 Fare: for type classes and Lisp, try my Lisp Interface Library
12:07 Fare: https://github.com/fare/lil-ilc2012/
12:08 Nisstyre: didi: another term for what I mean is "parametric polymorphism"
12:12 didi: Nisstyre: Just to end with some code from what I was talking about: <http://paste.kde.org/666980/>
12:12 bremner: well, typed racket can handle parametric polymorphism for individual functions, but I'm not sure about the aspect of typeclasses which define types as supporting certain operations.
12:13 Nisstyre: didi: okay, that's similar to ad-hoc polymorphism
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12:16 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 3 new commits to master: http://git.io/tgvq5Q
12:16 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 6c93cfe Robby Findler: move dir-chars.rkt to unstable/2d to unbreak dependencies
12:16 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 86b1f27 Robby Findler: tweak raco test output, yet again
12:16 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 4b9d43c Robby Findler: unbreak plai random mutator tests
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12:17 Fare: Nisstyre, no, type classes are precisely ad-hoc polymorphism, not parametric polymorphism (that is independently achieved in Haskell)
12:17 Nisstyre: Fare: I never said they were
12:17 Nisstyre: also they are more than just ad-hoc polymorphism
12:17 Nisstyre: you can do type level computations with type classes, etc...
12:20 Fare: either too much or not enough, though
12:20 Fare: reminds me of that Type-Oriented Aspect Meta-Programming thesis
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12:21 Nisstyre: Fare: it should be possible to have an entire language in that way
12:21 Nisstyre: I haven't seen that paper though
12:21 Nisstyre: I'm not deep enough into the whole type theory thing
12:23 djcoin: asumu: is there some kind of limitation to sweetjs ?
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12:28 djcoin: Javascript is killing me, we are doomed :) I know quite well js, but i'm tired of it too. Looking out for new languages that eventually can output js. So many people involved on a language that is kind of broken makes me sick :|
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12:33 Fare: djcoin, welcome to this world
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12:33 bremner: djcoin: do you know about whalesong?
12:35 djcoin: bremner: I saw it exists, but in fact I did not try it yet
12:35 djcoin: bremner: What is your opinion on whalesong ?
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12:36 bremner: djcoin: I haven't tried it either, but dyoo seems to make neat stuff, so that's a recommendation.
12:36 djcoin: There are quite a few languages that compile to JS. Tricky to choose
12:37 djcoin: Alright ! :)
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13:50 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 1 new commit to master: http://git.io/OBjL9w
13:50 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 9636a70 Asumu Takikawa: Add a test for PR 13490...
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15:20 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/D9Xvgg
15:20 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 9030da2 Eric Dobson: Make static single flonum checks correct....
15:20 RacketCommitBot: racket/master 830db3c Vincent St-Amour: Add extra tests and warning about -PosIntNotFixnum.
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15:42 asumu: I guess there is a canonical Racket impl of minikanren now https://github.com/miniKanren/Racket-miniKanren
15:42 asumu should take his planet2 package down and just pull request there
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16:04 dyoo: asumu: is there a test suite for mini-kanren anywhere?
16:05 dyoo: … besides just reading The Little Reasoner and doing the examples.  :)
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16:14 dyoo: asumu: I see that someone's done a mini-kanren for clojure, and that the test suite should be easy to adapt: https://github.com/jduey/mini-kanren/blob/master/test/mini_kanren/test/core.clj
16:14 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/a2r3aad
16:15 (part) dyoo
16:22 soegaard: I've got a strange interaction with DrRacket:   http://imgur.com/wSE6De5
16:23 soegaard: Any ideas that explains what I see?
16:23 soegaard: Notes:
16:23 asumu: o_O
16:23 asumu: (you mean the ld bits right?)
16:24 soegaard: No.
16:24 ozzloy: what's a mini-kanren?
16:24 soegaard: I need to explain a bit.
16:24 ozzloy: i'm gooogling
16:24 soegaard: The #lang minipascal fpc    line saves the pascal program in a .pas file.
16:24 soegaard: The uses system* to compile the program.
16:25 soegaard: Then it uses system* to run the program.
16:25 soegaard: The program in this case prints "Indtast:'  (enter:).
16:25 soegaard: So the program is running okay, and its output turns up in DrRacket.
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16:26 soegaard: Then the  readln(s) prompts DrRacket to display an input box.
16:26 soegaard: I entered abcdef
16:26 soegaard: Then I get the error.
16:26 soegaard: Then the Pascal program prints bcdef
16:26 soegaard: So the a went missing!
16:27 asumu: Hmmm, strange.
16:27 soegaard: Indeed the port can't be closed, since the other characters are ok.
16:28 soegaard: Also: If I run it in plain racket, it works fine.
16:28 soegaard: "plain racket" = from the command line
16:28 asumu: The docs for `write-bytes-avail` seems to claim it will only return an error if an error happens before any are written.
16:29 asumu: Oh, and that's an internal error from `copy-port` or something?
16:30 soegaard: Yes.
16:30 soegaard: I'll make a screen shot.
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16:31 soegaard: http://imgur.com/hdYJcKx
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16:35 soegaard: The code for system* contains calls to streamify-in and streamify-out in:            https://github.com/plt/racket/blob/master/collects/racket/private/streams.rkt
16:35 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/b3enz6w
16:35 soegaard: This sets up a "pipe", a thread that pumps output from one port into another.
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16:45 asumu: Doing something like (system* "/bin/cat") from DrRacket seems to work fine.
16:45 asumu: So maybe it is something the Pascal binary is doing.
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16:49 soegaard: That's possible.
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16:57 soegaard: But also strange.
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17:06 dyoo: soegaard: uh oh.  This reminds me very strongly of the error that tim nelson was getting about a year or so ago.
17:06 dyoo: let me see if I can find a reference...
17:07 dyoo: this one: http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.comp.lang.racket.user/1759
17:08 dyoo: The distinguishing feature that catches my attention is weirdness involving the first character of input.
17:09 dyoo: soegaard: what worries me is that what you're observing is on macosx, right?
17:09 soegaard: yes
17:09 soegaard: But only in DrRacket.
17:10 dyoo: You agree with me though that there's some uncanny similarity here though, right?
17:10 soegaard: Yes.
17:10 dyoo: Nuts.
17:11 dyoo: Let me see if I can reproduce.  Is this on minipascal HEAD?
17:12 soegaard: I'll check.
17:13 soegaard: yes. I believe it is uptodate
17:13 dyoo: ok, I need to grab free pascal compiler… might take a moment...
17:13 soegaard: http://www.freepascal.org/download.var
17:15 dyoo: ok, downloading freepascal 2.6.0 now.  Will take a few minutes.
17:16 soegaard: I have noticed the Pascal compiler is wicked fast.
17:18 dyoo: Random gripe:  I spent an hour trying to get stupid java, ant, and junit to work together.  I gave up.  Junit doesn't even seem to exist anymore.  None of the links on http://www.junit.org/ work.
17:24 asumu: dyoo: :\
17:26 dyoo: soegaard: confirmed: I'm seeing the ld: warnings as well on my macosx system.
17:26 dyoo: that part might not be drracket, but fpc.
17:26 dyoo: I'll have to check that in a moment...
17:26 soegaard: Add "-k-macosx_version_min 10.8"
17:27 dyoo: where?
17:27 soegaard: In fpc-compile
17:27 soegaard: It becomes:
17:27 soegaard: (system* "/usr/local/bin/fpc"  "-k-macosx_version_min 10.8" (~a "-o" out-file)
17:27 soegaard: pas-file)
17:27 soegaard: the -k passes the the following to the linker.
17:29 soegaard: I think the warnings from the linker are harmless. They are important, if the resulting binary is supposed to run on another machine with an older version of OS X.
17:30 dyoo: odd.  Ok, so I definitely can reproduce the error.
17:30 dyoo: But it's sensitive to what I type in.  I typed in 'blah', and it was happy.
17:30 dyoo: I then typed in 'abcdef' as the input, and I see what you're seeing.
17:30 soegaard: An if you typed blah again?
17:30 dyoo: ah, it got lost.
17:33 dyoo: wait a sec.
17:33 dyoo: soegaard: try (read-char) in interactions.
17:33 dyoo: What do you see?
17:34 soegaard: Hangon. I am trying.
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17:34 soegaard: I see the input box again ?!
17:35 dyoo: that part is ok.  But what I saw was "write-bytes-avail: output port is closed"
17:35 dyoo: (this was right after seeing the weird output from running a minipascal fpc program."
17:35 soegaard: ok
17:36 soegaard: that's weird too
17:37 dyoo: …!
17:37 dyoo: ok, found something.
17:37 soegaard: Now I see what you are seeing. But only in the case, where the first characters isn't missing.
17:37 dyoo: system* isn't blocking!
17:38 soegaard: huh?
17:38 dyoo: I put: (fprintf (current-error-port) "after: ~s\n" out-file)) right after the call to system*, but I see the log message immediately
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17:39 soegaard: The plot thickens
17:39 dyoo: oh, is fpc just compliing?  Oh.  Never mind, I got confused.  I thought fpc was evaluating as well.  I see that run is what evaluates the binary.  I'm an idiot.
17:41 soegaard: wait a minute
17:42 soegaard: no, that ain't it
17:42 dyoo: by the way, if I do something like (parameterize ([current-input-port (open-input-bytes #"abcde\n") …) around the run, I don't see this error.
17:43 dyoo: So this must be something to do with DrRacket's treatment of the current input port.
17:43 soegaard: Hmm.
17:44 soegaard: The DrRacket part doesn't show up in the stacktrace as far as I can tell
17:46 dyoo: tracing it down.  Ok, so DrRacket sets up its own current-input-port, attached to the repl, via http://git.racket-lang.org/plt/blob/HEAD:/collects/drracket/private/rep.rkt#l1552
17:46 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/be7s6kl
17:46 dyoo: searching for get-in-box-port...
17:47 dyoo: get-in-box-port is a method of the framework support libraries… http://docs.racket-lang.org/framework/Text.html#%28meth._%28%28%28lib._framework%2Fmain..rkt%29._text~3aports~3c~25~3e%29._get-in-box-port%29%29
17:47 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/bfx787r
17:49 dyoo: whose implementation appears to be in http://git.racket-lang.org/plt/blob/HEAD:/collects/framework/private/text.rkt#l2782
17:49 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/avhlvuv
17:49 dyoo: Reading code...
17:50 soegaard: ditto
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17:54 dyoo: what I think I'd do is look at the manufactured input port constructed in that function.  But I don't currently have time to do this right now; I was supposed to work on WeScheme right now.  :)
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17:54 dyoo: Bug submit just in case someone else wants to take a crack at this?
17:55 soegaard: Okay, thanks for confirming the bug. I'll submit a rapport.
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18:13 soegaard: Running the equivalent C program with system* from within DrRacket seems to work flawlessly.
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18:15 dyoo: soegaard: out of curiosity, how do things look like if you use subprocess directly?
18:15 soegaard: I'll try that
18:16 dyoo: I did see how the exception was showing up: it's in the implementation of system*, which does something called streamify-in
18:17 dyoo: and somewhere in there, it's doing a copy-port, which is ultimately the source of the error message you're seeing
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18:18 soegaard: Yes. I sae that too. And since they introduce threads, it might be a race condition.
18:21 soegaard: (subprocess (current-output-port) …)  fails, because the current error port in Racket isn't a file-stream. So the streamify-in and -out are needed.
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