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06:11 aidy: Is it OK to use hash tables for 'objects' in Racket, as you would in Clojure, or would that be very slow? Using structs with their type-specific lookup is a rather annoying...
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08:51 RacketCommitBot: [racket] plt pushed 2 new commits to master: http://git.io/jhaW-g
08:51 RacketCommitBot: [racket/master] added docs for a&d args of slideshow's dc procedure - Matthew Flatt
08:51 RacketCommitBot: [racket/master] fix docs for `syntax-id-rules' - Matthew Flatt
08:51 bremner: hmm. not an original thought, but the new plot framework is pretty slick
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10:09 asumu: aidy: Probably slower than structs, yeah. You could also use objects.
10:09 asumu: (from racket/class)
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10:09 asumu: bremner: Yeah, it's great. Go Neil Toronto.
10:11 veer: asumu: are you working on generics ?
10:18 asumu: veer: Just playing around, but yes. It'd be nice to have some form of it in Racket.
10:20 veer: you may also want to check my attempt here https://github.com/veer-public/Predicate-Dispatch
10:20 asumu: veer: Great, I will!
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14:55 offby1: perl6 apparently has what they call "macros" and "quasi-quoting" ...
14:55 gf3 switches to Perl6
14:55 offby1: https://gist.github.com/1548053 for the curious
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17:59 bremner: eli: are optional arguments disabled in pl on purpose?  I don't know much about them, but a student had a cute idea of using them for accumulators.
18:03 bremner: I mean, I don't know if there are good reasons not to have them, or just an extra distraction, or what.
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19:34 eli: bremner: Yeah, I intentionally don't include that feature.  It will complicate things unnecessarily.
19:35 eli: (My guess about the trick that your student came up with is to have something like (define (foo [accumulator 0]) ...), which I think is common in python.)
19:35 bremner: eli: right. It's not that big a deal, I was just curious.
19:36 bremner: although I'm skeptical people care about tail recursion in python ;)
19:36 eli: I don't remember the context, but I thought that I saw that in some python context...
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20:16 em: Please remind me, how do you do less than or equal in racket?
20:16 em: can you just put <= as the operator?
20:18 eli: rudybot: (<= 1 2)
20:18 rudybot: eli: your sandbox is ready
20:18 rudybot: eli: ; Value: #t
20:18 eli: em: ↑
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20:27 em: Yep that works thanks.
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20:34 Girffe: Hey, I just started using Ubuntu for CS, and I installed DrRacket, but I need to be able to run racket files from the terminal
20:34 Girffe: how can I install racket so that it works from the terminal?
20:34 bremner: Girffe: isn't the command "racket" included?
20:35 Girffe: it says, "racket: command not found" when I try to run something from the terminal
20:35 Girffe: I'm using Ubuntu 10.04 and I installed the Debian lenny version, was that the wrong version?
20:36 bremner: probably.
20:36 bremner: where did you get it?
20:37 Girffe: I got the installer from racket-lang.org
20:37 bremner: there is a PPA for ubuntu, I'm not sure if it supports 10.04
20:37 jonrafkind: Girffe, you probably have to run from where oyu installed it
20:37 jonrafkind: did it unpack to a local directory, like racket/ ?
20:38 Girffe: yeah, usr/racket
20:38 jonrafkind: oh you did a unix mode installation
20:38 jonrafkind: were you aware of how you instaled racket?
20:38 jonrafkind: i mean it gives you some choices
20:38 Girffe: I thought I said no to that initial option
20:38 jonrafkind: you should choose a 'normal style' installation
20:38 jonrafkind: as opposed to unix style
20:39 Girffe: I'll try reinstalling, pretty sure I chose the non-unix style though
20:39 jonrafkind: anyway the ppa supports 10.04
20:39 jonrafkind: Girffe, do you have administrator rights (sudo) ?
20:39 Girffe: yeah
20:39 jonrafkind: do you know how to install a ppa
20:39 Girffe: no
20:40 jonrafkind: https://launchpad.net/~plt/+archive/racket/+packages
20:40 Girffe: when I go to install, and I say no to unix style
20:40 jonrafkind: actually use this page https://launchpad.net/~plt/+archive/racket
20:40 Girffe: it asks for a directory
20:40 Girffe: and says /usr/racket is the default
20:40 jonrafkind: click 'read about installing'
20:45 Girffe: So I went through the instructions in read about installing
20:45 Girffe: and it worked, but racket still isn't accepted
20:45 Girffe: the tutorial says you're now ready to start installing things through the ppa, is there another step to actually install racket?
20:46 jonrafkind: sudo apt-get update
20:46 jonrafkind: sudo apt-get install racket
20:48 Girffe: ah, thanks
20:48 Girffe: so now that I did those initial steps, can I install any command just by typing sudo apt-get install command-name?
20:49 jonrafkind: well there has to be a package for it, but usually the package name is the same as the command name
20:50 jonrafkind: the 'racket' command comes from the 'racket' package. you now also have drracket
20:50 jonrafkind: but there is no drracket package
20:50 Girffe: where do you find drracket if you installed it this way?
20:50 jonrafkind: its installed in the same place as racket, in /usr/bin. just type drracket
20:50 jonrafkind: /usr/bin is already in your PATH so your system will find it
20:51 Girffe: ok, thanks for the help!
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21:10 eli: Girffe: With the sh installer, it would have created links in the right places at the end (after asking you).
21:10 eli: jonrafkind: Please don't recommend the unix-style installation blindly, there's a good reason it's not the default.
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21:21 jonrafkind: eli, at what point did I recommend the unix installer?
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21:22 eli: jonrafkind: Sorry, misread.
21:22 eli: (I thought that he did a normal install and you recommended the unix thing.)
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22:15 em: Could anyone describe how do you start a racket program from the command line in such a way that it takes some arguments ?  Like, if you wanted to do: :~$racketapp -arg1 -arg2 -arg3
22:15 em: how would that work so that the args get sent into the program?
22:16 jonrafkind: you can parse (current-command-line-arguments)
22:17 jonrafkind: or there is some macro that helps with that stuff
22:17 em: oh (current-command-line-arguments) sounds very promising.
22:18 jonrafkind: http://docs.racket-lang.org/reference/Command-Line_Parsing.html?q=command-line#(form._((lib._racket/cmdline..rkt)._command-line))
22:18 rudybot: http://tinyurl.com/6u6d6gv
22:18 em: would you always start a racket application like:  racket racketapp
22:19 em: or would you ever be able to just have a standalone racketapp that can be called from the command line?
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22:19 jonrafkind: you can put #!/usr/bin/racket in your program
22:19 jonrafkind: or make it into an executable with 'raco exe foobar.rkt'
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22:22 em: oh well that's great
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23:07 offby1: note that #!/usr/bin/racket isn't nearly enough
23:07 offby1: at least I use a rather long multi-line boilerplate thing that I'm not certain I could entirely explain
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23:11 jonrafkind: not enough for what
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23:33 offby1: I think if you just put #!/usr/bin/racket at the top of your script, it won't work
23:34 offby1: at least, I assume there's a good reason why I'm putting all the boilerplate in _my_ scripts :-|
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23:40 jonrafkind: cat x.rkt
23:40 jonrafkind: #!/usr/bin/env racket
23:40 jonrafkind: #lang racket
23:40 jonrafkind: "hello"
23:40 jonrafkind: ./x.rkt
23:40 jonrafkind: hello
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23:44 offby1: perhaps I'm doing what I'm doing because it _used_ to be necessary
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