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00:11 offby1 yawns
00:17 mithos28: offby1: it is still early
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02:43 neilv: there are many ways to talk about the arguments to a procedure
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02:45 neilv: lambda and related forms for code, contracts ("->" and "->*", through "provide/contract" and "define/contract"), typed scheme (":" and "define:"), and scribble ("defproc" etc.)
02:46 neilv: these many ways are a pain in the ass if you're trying to simplify authoring api documentation
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10:20 eli: jamessan, samth_away: the change to the github IRC notifications broke the thing.
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10:21 RacketCommitBot: [racket] none pushed 3 new commits to master: http://git.io/pC1yJA
10:21 RacketCommitBot: [racket/master] fix bad return for a void function - Matthew Flatt
10:21 RacketCommitBot: [racket/master] place ports are not regular files and should not be in text mode - Matthew Flatt
10:21 RacketCommitBot: [racket/master] remove incorrect port shutdown; windows: fix console ports for places - Matthew Flatt
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13:11 jonrafkind: samth, I look forward to your paper "on the attraction between two masses"
13:25 samth: jonrafkind: subtitle: "apples hurt more than i thought they would"
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13:32 jonrafkind: how do I typeset #lang?
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13:41 samth: jonrafkind: in what context?
13:42 jonrafkind: scribble, what else
13:42 Indecipherable: hey
13:42 samth: if you're writing something at the top of the docs for '#lang honu', then use `defmodulelang'
13:43 samth: if you want to write an example that uses #lang honu at the top, use `codeblock'
13:43 Indecipherable: May I ask a question about Datalog?
13:43 jonrafkind: actually when I try codeblock|{#lang honu}|, raco setup gets into an infinite loop and sucks up all memory
13:43 jonrafkind: but it works ok when its #lang racket, so maybe im doing something wrong
13:43 samth: Indecipherable: ask away
13:44 samth: jonrafkind: yeah, if it works for racket and not for honu, it's probably your bug
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13:45 jonrafkind: ok defmodulelang works GUUD
13:46 Indecipherable: Can I get all literals of the clause? I mean, not by substituting every entry with a variable
13:46 Indecipherable: :)
13:46 samth: Indecipherable: i don't understand what you mean
13:47 Indecipherable: e.g: names(bob, dylan, mark, molly).
13:47 samth: and what do you want?
13:47 samth: i know what literals are
13:47 Indecipherable: Usually I do this: names(A,B,C,D)?
13:47 Indecipherable: And I get the result
13:48 samth: you get A = bob, B = dylan, etc
13:49 Indecipherable: Yes
13:49 Indecipherable: But what if there are like 30 entries?
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13:49 samth: you probably don't want to be defining things like that
13:50 samth: if you have 30 different names, then you probably want name(bob). name(dylan). name(mark). name(molly).  etc
13:52 samth: for example, this program: #lang datalog
13:52 samth: name(molly).
13:52 samth: name(bob).
13:52 samth: name(A)?
13:52 samth: prints name(molly).
13:52 samth: name(bob).
13:54 Indecipherable: Yes
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13:54 Indecipherable: I started learning datalog yesterday so I'm still a bit nooby :)
13:54 samth: no problem
13:54 Indecipherable: Now I have another problem
13:54 samth: logic programming requires turning your brain in a different direction
13:55 samth: Indecipherable: ask away
13:57 Indecipherable: Ok, so I have bob, dylan and molly in the table name. One name per table
13:57 samth: sure
13:57 Indecipherable: I want to create a table that will look like this: names(bob, dylan, molly)
13:58 Indecipherable: I have this: names(A,B,C) :- name(A), name(B), name(C).
13:59 samth: Indecipherable: you probably can't do what you want in the general case
13:59 samth: full prolog has lists, but datalog (at least our version) doesn't
13:59 Indecipherable: The error is, I got what I wanted, but I also got all permutations
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14:00 samth: Indecipherable: right, because any permutation satisfies the premises
14:01 samth: Indecipherable: i have to run, jeapostrophe might be able to answer further questions
14:01 Indecipherable: Oohhh
14:02 jeapostrophe: i am here
14:02 Indecipherable: I mean, I can still extract the right table
14:02 Indecipherable: Thanks
14:02 Indecipherable: Hey, jeapostrophe!
14:03 jeapostrophe: Hey, and actually I just realized it is lunch time
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14:03 jeapostrophe: I will be back in 20 ish though
14:03 Indecipherable: Okay, see you. Enjoy your lunch lol
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15:12 dmac: Is there any way to define a macro that expands out to a lambda, and then access the arguments passed to that lambda outside the macro?
15:12 dmac: Example:
15:13 dmac: https://gist.github.com/1222866
15:13 dmac: I'd like access to 'bar' in the last line, but it's not in scope.
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15:27 jonrafkind: hm the racket commit bot is slow today
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16:01 samth: dmac: you should pass in the name of the function as an argument to the macro
16:03 dmac: samth: you mean give the lambda a name external to the macro, and then pass that name to foo?
16:03 dmac: rather than defining a lambda inside
16:03 samth: like this: (define-syntax-rule (foo arg form ...) ((lambda (arg) form ...) "ARG"))
16:04 jonrafkind: samth, did you disable the racket commit bot?
16:04 samth: jonrafkind: no
16:04 jonrafkind: i thought it was supposed to stay in the channel?
16:04 samth: eli said that it had broken, and he had to change it back to join/part
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16:07 dmac: samth: ah, I see. Thanks.
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16:08 weirdo: hello
16:08 Indecipherable: Is (make-table) not supported in Racket when running in the R5RS mode?
16:08 weirdo: why does racket build every single of its modules using a single process?
16:08 weirdo: i have a router with 256 mb of ram
16:09 weirdo: and building it without cross-compiling is extremely taxing on its swap
16:10 weirdo: Indecipherable, you can import it manually using #%require
16:11 bremner: why are you building racket on your router?
16:11 bremner: can't you use the debian arm binaries or something?
16:11 weirdo: i'm using freebsd
16:13 bremner: mkay.
16:13 bremner: I'd call you a weirdo, but you beat me to it ;)
16:15 Indecipherable: Racket is proving to be a really fun experience
16:15 Indecipherable: As fun as Common Lisp and Scheme
16:15 Indecipherable: I even lost some interest in Python. Shame.
16:16 weirdo: need a language to make some static html pages filled with collectd graphs
16:18 Indecipherable: Python doesn't take long to digest and it certainly has a lot of libraries
16:20 samth: weirdo: i don't see how multiple processes would help
16:26 weirdo: samth, so that non-dependencies would be unloaded when building something
16:27 samth: weirdo: that's what the garbage collector is for
16:28 samth: you can build it with multiple processes by using the -j option to 'raco setup'
16:32 weirdo: samth, apparently the GC isn't working for this case because during raco stage it takes 300+ MB of RAM, more with each module built
16:32 samth: is this while building the documentation, or while compiling the files?
16:37 bremner: weirdo: are you using cgc? that sucks, basically.
16:45 samth: oh yeah, that would defintely do it
16:48 weirdo: bremner, what am i supposed to do, then?
16:56 weirdo: cgc was invoked during the build stage
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17:02 samth: weirdo: cgc is used in bootstrapping
17:03 samth: but then it should build the 3m version
17:04 weirdo: samth, then it builds 3m with raco
17:05 weirdo: but with every built library it uses more and more ram
17:05 weirdo: soon it starts thrashing
17:05 weirdo: i think i'll make a package on some freebsd vm and transfer it over
17:06 samth: weirdo: we have someone here who's build racket on a router, i'll ask him
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17:09 samth: weirdo: you might also ask on the users mailing list
17:10 weirdo: for now i'll build on a separate box with enough ram and all
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17:22 weirdo: another thing is that a parallel build with -j9 doesn't work
17:23 weirdo: complains about libracket.la
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17:25 jonrafkind: can you make a bug report for that?
17:25 weirdo: sure
17:25 jonrafkind: specify how many cores you have, otherwise it may be hard to reproduce
17:28 weirdo: done
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17:38 Indecipherable: Is there a difference between (make-hash) and (hash) ?
17:38 samth: rudybot: doc hash
17:38 rudybot: samth: your racket/init sandbox is ready
17:38 rudybot: samth: http://docs.racket-lang.org/reference/hashtables.html#(def._((quote._~23~25kernel)._hash))
17:38 samth: rudybot: doc make-hash
17:38 rudybot: samth: http://docs.racket-lang.org/reference/hashtables.html#(def._((quote._~23~25kernel)._make-hash))
17:39 samth: Indecipherable: make-hash produces a mutable value, hash produces an immutable one
17:39 samth: and they take the intial values differently
17:40 Indecipherable: ohhh. Thanks
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17:51 Indecipherable: How do I download http://planet.racket-lang.org/display.ss?package=pyret.plt&owner=wrturtle ?
17:52 jonrafkind: type in that require line
17:52 jonrafkind: i mean, do you want to do something other than install it?
17:52 Indecipherable: I got an error: planet: ill-formed module path in: (planet "[file]" ("wrturtle" "pyret.plt" 1 3))
17:53 jonrafkind: hm try (require (planet wrturtle/pyret))
17:53 Indecipherable: I just want to install it
17:55 Indecipherable: thanks
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18:03 jonrafkind: how do I fix 'undefined tag' in scribble? i have (require foo (for-label foo)) I thought that was enough
18:04 jonrafkind: oh because i didn't deftech the symbol
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18:45 jbclements: tewk: did you see my e-mail re: C structure accesses in 5.1.3?
18:46 jonrafkind: he doesnt check irc often and hes not in the office anymore
18:46 jbclements: jonrafkind: ah, fooey. Thanks
18:46 jonrafkind: i know where he lives.. i could barge down his door!
18:46 jbclements: feel like e-mailing his cell phone number to me :) ?
18:48 jbclements: man, talk about IRC ineptitude; my client just told me I had a private message, but I can't figure out how to see it. !@#$ Colloquy...
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18:50 samth: jbclements: i hear emacs has an irc client ... :)
18:50 offby1: I'm using ERC Version 5.3 with GNU Emacs 24.0.50.1 (i686-pc-linux-gnu, multi-tty) of 2011-09-10.
18:50 offby1 glances around nervously.
18:50 samth: eli: please close pull req #53
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