00:00 carleastlund: Demosthenes, no, type-of would be ambiguous in Racket.  I could imagine (type-of 1) producing 'number, 'integer, 'exact-integer, 'exact-positive-integer, or 'fixnum.  You'd have to make up your own "type-of" for whatever sets of types are relevant in your program.
00:00 Demosthenes: i was thinking 'list, 'hash , 'atom, etc :P
00:00 Demosthenes: i guess its e-lisp that has type-of
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00:12 Demosthenes: carleastlund: i guess i'll use a match with (? number?) and other cases
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06:00 zx80: hello, how can I turn a string into a bytestring ?
06:01 zx80: oops was in doc... sorry
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06:42 Demosthenes: oh, that's a neat shortcut
06:43 Demosthenes: coming from perl i thought $a{c}->{d} => 5 was easy... and that (hash-ref (hash-ref a 'c) 'd) was kinda backward
06:43 Demosthenes: but the reader takes ((a . hash-ref . 'c) . hash-ref . 'd) too!
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07:15 Demosthenes: hrm, and #:keywords have to be quoted, interesting
07:23 Demosthenes: so i'm trying to test that a function returns an empty list using (check-test (func) '())
07:23 Demosthenes: gives an error, how should i test for empty list?
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07:45 ohwow: Is there something like paredit for DrRacket?
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08:20 Demosthenes: huh? Actual value #hasheq((a . 5)) differs from #hasheq((a . 5)), the expected value.
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08:29 Demosthenes: duh, one was #hasheq((a . 5)) and the other was #hasheq((a . "5")), and for some reason it dropped the fact it was a string
08:29 Demosthenes: but rackunit showed it correctly
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08:52 edw: OK, Scheme is not Haskell, so why does Racket complain if I write an IF without an alternate expression?
08:53 edw: It's like not letting me use `goto' in C.
08:55 ohwow: Can somebody please tell me what's wrong with my code? http://pastebin.com/7w3VaGtg for some reason server disconnects me
08:55 ohwow: edw: well that's how `if' defined in the standart :[
08:56 bremner_: edw: istr R5RS has the one branch if's
08:57 bremner_: edw: there is also "when"
08:57 edw: Wha? In my R7RS draft here, there's a one-branched IF.
08:57 bremner_: oh, well, what do I know.
08:58 bremner_: well, R5RS does have it.
08:58 edw: Dude, the standard's short enough that people might actually read it. Be careful when casually "referring" to it!
08:58 bremner_: well, I referred to the racket docs, and #lang R5RS
08:59 bremner_: since we're talking about racket...
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08:59 PLT_Notify: racket: master Matthew Flatt * 047c21e (1 files in 1 dirs): add missing Win64 library to get-libs script
08:59 PLT_Notify: racket: master Matthew Flatt * e972105 (15 files in 2 dirs): reorgnize datatypes of less common bytecode forms ...
08:59 PLT_Notify: racket: master commits af56616...e972105 - http://bit.ly/md4dVy
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08:59 edw: Yeah, right there in section 4.1.5 of R5RS... So if I #lang r5rs it'll work? How so I do that from a REPL?
09:00 edw: Well, I re-wrote my code to pretend to be functional...
09:00 bremner_: you have to give a command line option to set the language
09:01 bremner_: I think
09:01 edw: Ah. Geiser takes twenty minutes to launch a listener. I'll just re-wrote my code.
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09:31 ohwow: Is there a way to define own `data types', like http://api.call-cc.org/doc/chicken/special-forms/define-record in Chicken?
09:32 ohwow: ah, it's struct
09:32 ohwow: sorry
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11:15 samth: edw, use `when' for 1-branch ifs
11:16 samth: Demosthenese, `display' drops the "" from strings
11:16 samth: EM03, you seem to be missing an '('
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11:33 ohwow: smath is here for the rescue
11:33 ohwow: :)
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11:36 samth: ohwow, i try to help :)
11:36 samth: clklein, ping
11:36 samth: eli, ping
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11:38 eli: samth: ?
11:38 bremner_: smath is a nice typo
11:39 samth: eli, what do i need to do to write a web page (for racket-lang.org)?
11:40 eli: samth: You mean con.racket-lang.org?
11:40 samth: eli, yes
11:41 samth: mithos28, running a build with your branch now
11:41 eli: samth: So you want the new toplevel thing, right?
11:42 samth: eli, i want an image in the upper right, like the one here: http://dherman.github.com/taskjs/
11:42 samth: but i'll worry about that, i just want to know where i should look to start writing the page?
11:42 eli: Yeah, the immage is irrelevant.
11:42 eli: You'll basically need to grab the CSS that does that.
11:43 eli: But before you get there, just mail me some rough text and I'll add that, and going on from there would be easy.
11:44 ohwow: Hm. this is not really a Racket question, but still. When I run Racket code in GNU Emacs using scheme-mode it gives me the output (side effects done via wirte, etc) after finishing running the code
11:45 ohwow: but what if my code runs forever and I need to look at side effects?
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11:52 samth: eli, i don't want to mail you text, i want to write the file myself
11:59 bremner_: ohwow: are you talkin about debugging, or something else?
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11:59 ohwow: Well, when I do `run-scheme' and enter stuff there
11:59 ohwow: it waits for whatever I entered there to exit
11:59 clklein: samth: pong
12:00 ohwow: and then shows me everything
12:00 bremner_: so, uh, generate output earlier?
12:00 samth: clklein, i'm having a really weird bug with redex
12:01 samth: it's complaining that a particular rule generates something not in the right grammar
12:01 ohwow: huh?
12:01 samth: but that rule is *definitely* not applicable
12:01 clklein: samth: Is it one of the random testing forms that's complaining?
12:01 samth: and when i take the rule out, it complains about a different, and similarly inapplicable, rule
12:01 samth: no, it's test-->>
12:02 clklein: Oh, is there a #:domain contract on the relation?
12:03 samth: clklein, yes
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12:05 eli: samth: Just some skeleton, so I can start it.  If you really want a one-shot thing I can put some random placeholder text.
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12:06 clklein: samth: Is there a file that you can easily post or a repo I can easily clone?
12:07 samth: eli, put a placeholder page in with no text
12:07 samth: what repo are the pages in?
12:08 samth: clklein, one sec
12:10 eli: samth: How long will it take you to do the content?
12:11 eli: => If it's something that will be done today then there's no problem with me adding some text and just not running a new build.
12:11 eli: Alternatively I'll comment the sample.
12:11 samth: clklein, see samth/tmp/redex in git
12:11 samth: eli, it might take more than today
12:12 eli: ok
12:12 samth: clklein, just try running '(go)'  in step.rkt
12:12 clklein: samth: k
12:15 bremner_: ohwow: I'm not familiar with run-scheme, but you might find a real REPL more like geiser more comfortable
12:16 ohwow: hmm geiser
12:16 ohwow: http://www.nongnu.org/geiser/ ?
12:16 bremner_: sounds right
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12:22 ohwow: thanks, bremner_ !
12:23 ohwow: hmm
12:23 ohwow: it actually has the same problem
12:23 ohwow: :/
12:24 bremner_: I guess I still don't understand the problem.
12:24 ohwow: Ok, I have the following code https://gist.github.com/959088
12:24 ohwow: when I run (test) in the repl (geiser) nothing happens
12:24 ohwow: but when I do C-c C-c (which aborts it) I recieve a lot of input at once
12:25 ohwow: all that stuff that shouldv'e been outputed during the execution
12:25 bremner_: did you try in the DrRacket debugger?
12:26 ohwow: yes, in DrRacket it works fine
12:26 bremner_: and on the command line with "racket foo.rkt" ?
12:26 ohwow: no.. i am going to do that right now
12:27 ohwow: yeah command line works just fine
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12:27 PLT_Notify: racket: master Eric Dobson * e9683e1 (1 files in 1 dirs): Changed early failure in subtyping to all non-struct values, not just null. Closes PR 11887. - http://bit.ly/jJRHaY
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12:27 samth: mithos28, pushed
12:28 samth: mithos28, also, can you try adding unit tests as well as integration tests for the features you've done?
12:28 samth: thanks!
12:28 bremner_: ohwow: sounds like some problem with output buffering. I'm afraid I don't know more than that.
12:29 ohwow: yeah it's strange because (let loop () (display "hi")(loop)) works as expected :/
12:38 clklein: samth: I agree that something seems wrong -- in fact, maybe two somethings.
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12:39 samth: clklein, do you have a suggestion for how i should go about debugging it
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12:50 clklein: samth: I've got it down to a self-contained 97 lines
12:51 clklein: My suspicion is that union-reduction-relation screws up the rule names.
12:52 clklein: Also, something weird might be happening when you take the context closure of a reduction relation with a #:domain contract.
12:53 clklein: Err, looks like that second thing isn't happening.
12:53 clklein: I'll keep looking.
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12:59 samth: clklein, thanks for looking into this!
12:59 samth: does that mean that there is a bug of that form, just with a different rule name?
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13:42 samth: clklein, it might help with your debugging to know that the problem was in the `concrete-mod-ref' rule
13:44 samth: clklein, i've now pushed the fix to that repo, so you can see it
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16:36 clklein: samth: http://paste.lisp.org/display/121825
16:38 clklein: err, the "without contract" name isn't very good :)
16:39 (quit) mithos28: Quit: mithos28
16:39 samth: yeah, that seems not so good
16:40 samth: clklein, i'd just call the rules "1" and "2"
16:40 clklein: yea, definitely better
16:41 samth: but that does seem to be the minimal example
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16:43 samth: clklein, is there a simple workaround?
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17:08 EM03: samth: hey i answered my own question
17:10 EM03: what does it mean when a return value is void?
17:10 EM03: mean the same thing as unspecified value?
17:14 samth: EM03, racket doesn't have an unspecified value
17:15 samth: you can see the docs for `void?' here: http://docs.racket-lang.org/reference/void.html
17:20 jonrafkind: rudybot: (letrec ([x x]) x)
17:20 rudybot: jonrafkind: your sandbox is ready
17:20 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; Value: #<undefined>
17:20 samth: jonrafkind, that's a different thing
17:20 jonrafkind: psh
17:20 samth: no, really
17:20 samth: "the/an unspecified value" is a concept from Scheme standardization
17:21 samth: in all of those places, racket produces void
17:21 samth: and is specified to do so
17:22 jonrafkind: ok, so sounds like void is the unspecified value
17:23 EM03: samth: why when doing (display 10) is the 10 just returned and not a void value? in some implementations of scheme 10 is an unspecified value
17:24 jonrafkind: 10 isn't returned, its printed
17:24 DT``: EM03, the 10 is printed, (void) is returned.
17:25 DT``: rudybot, (begin (display 10) 2)
17:25 rudybot: DT``: your r5rs sandbox is ready
17:25 rudybot: DT``: ; Value: 2
17:26 DT``: what, and the 10?
17:26 jonrafkind: rudybot: (begin (display 10) (newline))
17:26 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; stdout: "10\n"
17:26 jonrafkind: rudybot: (begin (display 10) (newline) 2)
17:26 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; Value: 2
17:26 jonrafkind: ok rudybot is wierd
17:26 DT``: rudybot, (begin (define x 2) x)
17:26 rudybot: DT``: ; Value: 2
17:27 DT``: well, at least it gets evaluated.
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17:33 samth: EM03, "an unspecified value" means it could be any value, 10, "hello", '(1 2 3), or anything else
17:33 samth: however, there are no situations where *Racket* produces an unspecified value
17:34 samth: meaning that it's always precisely specified what Racket returns
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17:56 (nick) Sandy -> Guest47738
17:56 Guest47738: have not been able to get by choose language step. anyone can help?
17:56 jonrafkind: whats your language set to now
17:57 Guest47738: beginning
17:57 jonrafkind: is that what you want it on?
17:57 Guest47738: yes
17:58 jonrafkind: what is your issue
17:59 Guest47738: should I start with:  Quick: An Introduction to Racket with Pictures
17:59 jonrafkind: do you already know how to program?
17:59 Guest47738: no. total novice
17:59 jonrafkind: you should try htdp.org
18:00 jonrafkind: http://htdp.org/2003-09-26/Book/
18:00 Guest47738: thank you. will do.
18:04 Guest47738: the Racket folder Racket v5.1.1 is open on my desktop and the file is mounted. what should I do with that? How do I get it to my applications folder?
18:04 EM03: rudybot: (display 10)
18:04 rudybot: EM03: your sandbox is ready
18:04 rudybot: EM03: ; stdout: "10"
18:05 EM03: rudybot: (display (printf "dsfdsf"))
18:05 rudybot: EM03: ; stdout: "dsfdsf#<void>"
18:05 EM03: why when I passed 10 did it not return a void?
18:07 jonrafkind: it did, but rudybot ignores void in liue of printing stdout
18:07 jonrafkind: rudybot: (void? (display 10))
18:07 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; Value: #t
18:07 jonrafkind: rudybot: (let ([x (display 10)]) x)
18:07 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; stdout: "10\n1010"
18:07 jonrafkind: wtf
18:08 jonrafkind: rudybot: (let ([x (display 10)]) x)
18:08 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; stdout: "10"
18:08 jonrafkind: rudybot: (let ([x (display 10)]) (void))
18:08 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; stdout: "10"
18:08 EM03: hmmm?
18:08 jonrafkind: so rudybot ignores void
18:09 EM03: it did not ignore the printf one
18:09 jonrafkind: you displayed it
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18:09 jonrafkind: rudybot: (display (void))
18:09 rudybot: jonrafkind: ; stdout: "#<void>"
18:10 jonrafkind: but its not a return value, its printed on stdout
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18:13 EM03: hmmm?
18:13 EM03: why am I still confused
18:13 EM03: i printed out the "thisrighthere" and in doing so it returns void?
18:13 jonrafkind: yea
18:14 jonrafkind: usually the repl wont print voids
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18:28 EM03: jonrafkind: I hate to dwell on this but i don't want to use something without understanding it ....so was it the return of the string that printed that out or the return of the actual printf function?
18:29 jonrafkind: the return of printf was printed out by display
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18:29 jonrafkind: you saw the output of both printf and display, where the output of printf is 'dsfds' and the output of display is '#<void>'
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18:33 PLT_Notify: racket: master Robby Findler * 2fe1c3b (6 files in 5 dirs): document the help collection's top-level modules
18:33 PLT_Notify: racket: master Robby Findler * 70b0eb8 (1 files in 1 dirs): make raco setup call raise-user-error instead of error when reporting malformed command-line collection paths
18:33 PLT_Notify: racket: master commits 8ce2ec7...70b0eb8 - http://bit.ly/kzcLhq
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18:36 samth: clklein, ping
18:37 samth: clklein, this error message could be improved: matcher.ss: found zero holes when matching a decomposition
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19:18 EM03: jonrafkind: you saw the output of both printf and display, where the output of printf is 'dsfds' and the output of display is '#<void>'
19:19 EM03: so if thats true
19:19 EM03: why does (display 10) not print out the void for display?
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19:54 elliottcable: Hey all.
19:54 elliottcable: Anybody here gotten Racket to build on OS X 10.7?
19:55 elliottcable: here’s the stdout and segfault crash report from the compilation for 32-bit (https://gist.github.com/960017) and 64-bit (https://gist.github.com/960028)
19:55 samth: elliottcable, you should post to the users@ mailing list
19:55 elliottcable: oh no, mailing lists )-:
19:55 elliottcable: ’kay…
19:55 samth: the mac devs aren't mostly on irc
19:56 elliottcable: is there a Google Groups interface or something?
19:56 samth: yes
19:56 elliottcable: i.e. won’t require me to use a damn e-mail client in 2011… :3
19:56 elliottcable: link me up! :D
19:56 samth: click the community tab on the web page
19:56 elliottcable: ty!
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21:10 Counterspell: I am trying to use racket/trace but I get the error: set!: cannot modify a constant: proc-i-am-trying-to-trace
21:11 Counterspell: oh nevermind
21:11 Counterspell: looks like you can't run (trace f) in the REPL must be int he file
21:11 Counterspell: *the
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